| sensys | I have some problem with wrining devuan on my usb stick. I can't just start, if I writed usb with dd(according to instructions on site), but using balenaEtcher it worked. Can you tell my why? | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| rrq | can you share the exact dd command (that failed)? | 00:14 |
| rwp | The site instructions at https://www.devuan.org/os/documentation/install-guides/daedalus/install-devuan say "dd if=filename.iso of=/dev/sdX bs=1M && sync" | 00:48 |
| rwp | I prefer using: dd if=filename.iso of=/dev/sdX bs=1M iflag=fullblock oflag=sync,direct | 00:48 |
| rrq | yes, but that's a template, not an actual command | 00:49 |
| rwp | That way writing the data does not overwhelm the file system buffer cache for other files and when the dd is done the writing is done. | 00:49 |
| rrq | before guessing about issues I'd like to sight the actual command | 00:49 |
| rwp | You seem to have missed that I was making a critique of the web site's template. It's not lame but it isn't as nice as it could be. | 00:50 |
| rrq | sorry, I didn't mean to imply that I critisized you; I know the web site authors are very happy getting feedback and suggestions about improvments. | 00:53 |
| rwp | I don't know how long iflag=fullblock oflag=sync,direct flags have existed but now that they do exist those are perfect for writing to flash storage. | 00:55 |
| rwp | The direct avoids pushing other stuff out of the file system buffer cache because we are just going to detach the storage in a moment anyway. | 00:55 |
| rwp | The sync avoids buffering so that when the dd command is finished writing then the nand flash storage has been written to and it can immediately be removed. | 00:56 |
| rwp | As opposed to waiting for the full global file system sync to finish which means that all of every file in writing has finished writing. | 00:56 |
| rwp | I usually couple that with "pv" which makes for a super nice progress feedback bar. pv devuan_daedalus_5.0.0_amd64_netinstall.iso | dd of=/dev/sdX bs=1M iflag=fullblock oflag=sync,direct | 00:57 |
| rwp | When used with pv like that then the status feedback progress bar is super nice. | 00:57 |
| rrq | I go the impression sensys is not especially keen to pursue their query | 00:58 |
| rrq | got | 00:58 |
| rwp | I usually get the impression that cheap crappy flash storage are half of the problem. The rest of the time the problem is the OS (Windows or Mac) used to write the flash. | 01:00 |
| rwp | I have a Crucial USB flash drive that boots one of my computers okay but absolutely refuses to boot a different machine. Why? No idea. Other than it being USB and USB being terrible. But I have to use a different USB flash storage to boot other machines. | 01:02 |
| sensys | sorry, I just trying to use irssi first time | 01:05 |
| sensys | yes, I used default command from site(dd if=filename.iso of=/dev/sdX bs=1M && sync) | 01:07 |
| rrq | did you type exactly that? you need to replace filename.iso and /dev/sdX appropriately | 01:08 |
| sensys | I know it | 01:08 |
| rrq | ok. what did your replace them with? | 01:09 |
| sensys | sudo dd if=devuan.iso of=/dev/sdb bs=1M && sync | that's it | 01:11 |
| rrq | thanks. I assume "devuan.iso" is the actual name of the ISO file that you had downloaded to that directory... | 01:12 |
| sensys | yes, it is | 01:12 |
| rrq | what was the first response line from that command? did it start copying? | 01:13 |
| rrq | (skip you entering password) | 01:15 |
| sensys | I think, that it's just went as usual | 01:15 |
| rrq | that would mean that apart from you entering password, there was only a timing report at the end telling that it had copied all 456Mb onto the USB... ? | 01:17 |
| sensys | yes | 01:18 |
| rrq | ok. but then the system didn't boot using that USB? | 01:19 |
| sensys | this usb stick didn't appear in uefi mod, but in legacy I was able to start from usb, but I got error: "Failed to load ldlinux.32 Boot failed: press a key to retry..." | 01:23 |
| rrq | ok; that sounds like the USB key was removed after writing before all writing had happened. | 01:25 |
| rrq | exactly what rwp discussed above | 01:25 |
| rrq | the ISO has its EFI image at the end | 01:26 |
| rrq | if you want to try again, you should add the "conv=fdatasync" argument to the dd command .. and/or "oflags=sync,direct" | 01:29 |
| sensys | maybe I'll try it on virtual machine, thanks | 01:29 |
| rrq | thanks for reporting :) | 01:32 |
| gnarface | ted-ious: they have a huge number of devices and honestly not all of them are well supported, but i've also had good luck with the ones that are, and they're usually cheap and easy to find too (unlike the intel wifi stuff they compete with) | 03:17 |
| gnarface | for their wired stuff i've literally never had a problem | 03:18 |
| gnarface | maybe just luck of the draw, i dunno | 03:18 |
| gnarface | they're hardly a poster child for welcoming open source, but they're also not up against stiff competition in that regard either | 03:19 |
| gnarface | if sensys comes back, tell them to just try it without the "bs=1M" part; sometimes large block sizes corrupt writes on cheaper/older devices | 03:21 |
| gnarface | and i recommend using "conv=fsync" instead of the other combinations, because according to the man page that's the one that actually sounds most appropriate, but the "&& sync" approach should have worked just as well. my guess is the culprit was the block size. | 03:22 |
| gnarface | ted-ious: and yes, i do recall a specific issue where a few of their popular models of wifi devices couldn't do host mode in linux and then it turned out they could if you get the driver+firmware versions directly from their website, but it wasn't actually clear that was their fault | 03:35 |
| gnarface | the linux kernel devs often refuse drivers for "reasons" | 03:36 |
| gnarface | "reasons" like "i don't own that hardware so nobody else must either" or "it's working fine for me, why would you need that?" | 03:37 |
| gnarface | or "we're still holding a grudge because of the soundcard driver issues, so we're gonna put our thumb on your other stuff" | 03:37 |
| ted-ious | That sounds like certain dev's and zfs. | 03:44 |
| gnarface | now, mind you, i wouldn't put any of their stuff into a benchmarking competition if i wanted to win, but that's hardly the point | 03:55 |
| gnarface | i got a 9$ usb wifi module and it works great in everything and it's smaller than my fingernail - i couldn't even get the broadcom one to work at all | 03:55 |
| gnarface | (the broadcom one onboard in the mobile device that i bought the usb dongle for) | 03:56 |
| gnarface | i've never once had a realtek ethernet chip under any brand name fail to transmit data, but i've run into two Intel ones that intermittently fail to be recognized as online at boot up time by D-Link switches, an issue that is apparently nearly unknown in the community despite that there's public records of Intel suing D-Link for it | 03:58 |
| gnarface | (and a D-Link parnership with Dell apparently falling through as fallout of that) | 03:58 |
| gnarface | but the result is that nobody will admit to the bug or fix it | 03:59 |
| gnarface | never had that issue with a Realtek ethernet device | 03:59 |
| gnarface | i'm sure the Intel one would beat them in every benchmark, but what good is that if 50% of the time i have to walk over to the switch and unplug it, wait 60 seconds, then plug it back in | 04:00 |
| gnarface | sorry, this rant has gone way offtopic | 04:00 |
| ted-ious | I think it's very much on topic if realtek ethernet cards are better supported and more reliable under devuan. | 04:02 |
| ted-ious | I doubt I could get a rpm to install a better driver and even if I could I wouldn't want to. | 04:03 |
| gnarface | to be clear, the only solution to that problem was to spend $150 more on a different brand of switch | 04:04 |
| gnarface | (D-Link sold 16-port switches at less than 1/4th the cost of the nearest competitor's 16-port switches) | 04:05 |
| gnarface | (they're also not fast enough to write home about, but again... cost and reliability usually trump benchmarking wins in practical use cases) | 04:05 |
| rrq | please, do continue at #devuan-offtopic | 04:06 |
| gnarface | sorry | 04:06 |
| gry | good morning all | 04:21 |
| arity | o/ | 04:34 |
| dokma | Devuan's busybox cannot mount ext4 because the module isn't loaded and busybox does not have neither insmod nor modprobe | 12:21 |
| dokma | I'm stuck in the installer and cannot get the root fs mounted | 12:22 |
| gnarface | hmm, seems weird | 12:22 |
| dokma | I even reformatted it to ext2 which is supposedly supported by the kernel and does not need a module but busybox cannot mount even that | 12:22 |
| gnarface | you sure it's not just a PATH issue? | 12:23 |
| dokma | At the same time blkid, lsblk, fdisk -l and mkfs.ext2 all work just fine | 12:23 |
| dokma | What could be wrong with the PATH | 12:23 |
| gnarface | missing? | 12:23 |
| gnarface | missing /sbin i dunno | 12:23 |
| dokma | I do have /sbin in PATH | 12:23 |
| dokma | I can run busybox I just can't mount using it | 12:24 |
| dokma | What loads the modules that are loaded since it obviously isn't busybox ??? | 12:24 |
| gnarface | it didn't used to be a problem anyway, but it isn't something i've tested in the current installer | 12:24 |
| gnarface | this is the netinstall iso? | 12:24 |
| dokma | tried netinstall first, when it didn't work I tried desktop | 12:25 |
| arity | mount -t ext4 /dev/sdax | 12:25 |
| dokma | doesn't work | 12:25 |
| dokma | ext4 module isn't loaded | 12:25 |
| dokma | it can't even mount ext2 | 12:26 |
| rrq | is this with the rescue shell? | 12:26 |
| dokma | rescue from the installer | 12:27 |
| dokma | grep ext /proc/modules gives nothing | 12:27 |
| dokma | and busybox --list | grep mod gives nothing but chmod | 12:28 |
| dokma | so I have no way of mounting anything | 12:28 |
| dokma | how was this supposed to work? | 12:28 |
| rrq | let me understand "where" you are at... is that by selecting "rescue" at booting the iso? | 12:30 |
| dokma | no it is as selecting install when booting the iso from stick | 12:31 |
| dokma | then while going through the steps the installer fails at partitioning because I cannot designate any partition as root | 12:32 |
| dokma | so I wanted to go to rescue and format the drive manually and mount the root partition to /target and restart the installer | 12:32 |
| dokma | but I cannot mount anything | 12:32 |
| rrq | ?? do you boot "rescue mode" or boot "install" ? | 12:33 |
| dokma | I boot install | 12:33 |
| rrq | and, then you go through the dialogs up to partitioning? | 12:33 |
| dokma | exactly and then partitioning fails because I do not get an option to designate my root partition | 12:34 |
| dokma | all I get is "Do not use the partition" and "Swap" | 12:34 |
| dokma | so I went to shell in the installer to partition and mkfs and mount to /target | 12:34 |
| dokma | but I cannot mount because no filesystem modules are loaded | 12:34 |
| dokma | and busybox has no modprobe or insmod | 12:34 |
| rrq | how do you get a command line? | 12:36 |
| dokma | I just go to the shell option something like third from the bottom in the installer | 12:36 |
| gnarface | dokma: this is the daedalus version, current stable? | 12:38 |
| rrq | ok; so at the partitioners first dialog, you select "go back" and then "execute a shell" .. I'm there too.. | 12:38 |
| dokma | devuan_excalibur_6.0-202406062333_i386_desktop.iso | 12:38 |
| gnarface | oh, testing | 12:38 |
| gnarface | daily build, maybe just broken | 12:38 |
| dokma | ohh... let me go with stable | 12:38 |
| rrq | ok; should be same as daedalus | 12:39 |
| gnarface | i found some reference that comes up in searches for other distros something about busybox switching to a stripped-down modprobe and having to switch back? not sure | 12:39 |
| rrq | well, the dadalus iso does have modprobe.. I need to chekc excalibur | 12:39 |
| gnarface | and make sure you get the right architecture, i see you have the i386 one there but you almost certainly actually want the amd64 one, unless your machine is quite old | 12:39 |
| dokma | Lenovo 3000 C200 2007 | 12:40 |
| dokma | 32bit | 12:40 |
| gnarface | hmmm... | 12:41 |
| dokma | nothing would've worked anyway if I missed the bittage | 12:41 |
| rrq | hmm amd64 does have modprobe .. need to get i386 then | 12:41 |
| rrq | .. few minutes | 12:43 |
| dokma | writing iso to the stick | 12:43 |
| gnarface | dokma: nope, it's 64-bit. you were sold a 32-bit copy of Windows and told it was only a 32-bit chip because Microsoft's 64-bit Windows build wasn't ready yet and they didn't want you to switch to Linux in case you knew the Linux one was already | 12:43 |
| gnarface | dokma: use the amd64 one, it'll be faster | 12:43 |
| gnarface | https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/49490/intel-atom-processor-d525-1m-cache-1-80-ghz.html | 12:44 |
| gnarface | google says it's this chip | 12:44 |
| gnarface | dokma: (happened to a lot of core2duo customers around then too) | 12:45 |
| dokma | hmmm... let me check | 12:45 |
| dokma | it does seem to be 64bit | 12:45 |
| gnarface | it should still be able to also run 32-bit code at the same time just like with other amd64 cpus | 12:46 |
| gnarface | not that that's a huge amount of benefit unless you're running Steam or Wine but still... | 12:46 |
| gnarface | nice to ahve | 12:47 |
| gnarface | *nice to have | 12:47 |
| dokma | getting 64 daedalus desktop iso rn | 12:47 |
| rrq | ok, confrmed that the i386 busybox lacks modprobe applet .. surprise to me | 12:47 |
| dokma | lucky for me... would've ended with a 32bit os on a 64bit machine | 12:48 |
| gnarface | i still can't believe there hasn't been a class-action lawsuit. apparently i'm the only one who has noticed so far. | 12:48 |
| gnarface | sorry, i'm offtopic again | 12:48 |
| dokma | rrq: are you gonna report that? | 12:51 |
| rrq | dokma: yes, thanks for testing and reporting :) .. I need to look into that; maybe just that debain has stopped maintaining i386 | 12:51 |
| dokma | this goes upstream? | 12:51 |
| rrq | yes the iso is mostly with debian udebs | 12:52 |
| rrq | admittedly I have treated i386 a bit back-handedly myself, but I expected its busybox would have same applets as amd64 | 12:54 |
| rrq | we might need a devuan policy discussion/decision re i386 as it might be a fair few packages the start maintaining | 12:57 |
| rrq | I guess it's also possible that busybox is a special case | 12:59 |
| rrq | or that the iso got built badly | 13:01 |
| dokma | I don't know anything about how this is packed | 13:03 |
| dokma | But if any help is needed to stay off the systemd travesty I'm willing to put in some work | 13:03 |
| dokma | *stave off* | 13:03 |
| dokma | nope, this kernel requires an x86-64 cpu but only detected an i686 cpu | 13:27 |
| dokma | it is a 32bit machine | 13:27 |
| buZz | i dont think debian stopped doing 32bit | 13:33 |
| buZz | they likely wont for a long time | 13:33 |
| buZz | is it not that 64bit busybox also is built without modprobe? | 13:34 |
| rrq | the amd64 iso does have modprobe so I'm not sure.. will have to investigate | 13:46 |
| rrq | (same verison code 1.36.1-7) | 13:48 |
| rrq | (looks like iso building issue) | 13:56 |
| rrq | dokma: does the daedalus i386 iso have the same problem? | 13:57 |
| buZz | rrq: are you sure its not the modprobe package where that modprobe comes from? | 14:00 |
| buZz | rrq: does the -debian- i386 iso show the same? | 14:00 |
| rrq | I don't know about debian isos | 14:01 |
| buZz | well, devuan ones are 99% the debian ones | 14:01 |
| buZz | so the question could be 'did devuan degrade the experience or is this how debian decided it should happen' | 14:01 |
| rrq | the busybox of the inistaller's initrd is supposed to be busybox-static=1:1.36.1-7 | 14:02 |
| buZz | i'm not sure, are you equatting initrd with the whole iso? | 14:03 |
| rrq | the installer filesystem that you come to in that "execute shell" is the initrd | 14:04 |
| buZz | rrq: btw, you can press alt+f2 inside the installer, to get to a terminal 'directly' | 14:04 |
| rrq | yes, that's the initrd | 14:04 |
| rrq | I'm looking into its packaging | 14:04 |
| buZz | rrq: and have you tried just making the symlink from 'modprobe' to the busybox on it? | 14:04 |
| buZz | that could be the only missing thing , perhaps | 14:04 |
| rrq | the source for all this is at git.devuan.org:devuan/installer-iso | 14:05 |
| rrq | yes, busybox says the "applet" is missing | 14:05 |
| buZz | right | 14:06 |
| rrq | hmmm the initrd's busybix is the dynamic variant | 14:08 |
| rrq | hmmm(??) so it is for amd64 too | 14:10 |
| rrq | dokma: busybox-static_1.36.1-7_i386.deb is in the pool on the iso, but you'll have to unpack it using "ar" and "tar" since there is no dpkg either | 14:16 |
| dokma | is that true for daedalus too? | 14:17 |
| rrq | or, there is also an "emergency mode" to boot up into the preamble only, which does have busybox-static | 14:18 |
| rrq | I need to check up daedalus, but I confirmed it has modprobe | 14:18 |
| rrq | the "emergency mode" is entered if you add "emerg" to the boot command line... first TAB then add emerg (those 5 letters) | 14:20 |
| rrq | that will stop within the pramble filesystem, before the installer. | 14:20 |
| rrq | you can do hands-on into an installed system from there | 14:21 |
| rrq | should be able to mount the target (with -t ext4) and then chroot | 14:21 |
| rrq | the preamble does not have networking modules though | 14:24 |
| rrq | hmm, ath the emerg shell, the installer initrd is unpacked as /target so possibly you can copy the preamble busybox into that target filesystem, then exit, which I believe should continue with swotch_root as per normal | 14:26 |
| gnarface | dokma: it's definitely a 64-bit machine but i can't be sure the debian builds have proper atom support, i've never actually tried it | 14:34 |
| dokma | well that's gnarly... | 14:36 |
| dokma | maybe I should finally try Ubuntu | 14:36 |
| fsmithred | double your ram first | 14:36 |
| gnarface | dokma: you could probably just use their kernel then build your own | 14:38 |
| fsmithred | Oh, would it work to boot ubuntu, install devuan debootstrap and then do a debootstrap install of devuan from the live system? | 14:39 |
| gnarface | dokma: hmm, actually looking into this more it's possible you might need to change the bios, or you might need to just boot it in 32-bit mode before switching to 64-bit mode. i guess it might not be as easy as i was expecting. | 14:40 |
| gnarface | fsmithred: i think it would work. i think it would also work to just manually copy over the ubuntu kernel & modules... but that's both assuming it's not a bios or uefi issue | 14:41 |
| dokma | https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/29740/intel-pentium-processor-t2080-1m-cache-1-73-ghz-533-mhz-fsb/specifications.html | 14:42 |
| dokma | that's an actual 32 bit cpu | 14:42 |
| gnarface | that's not the one your product manual listed though | 14:43 |
| dokma | where did you look that up? | 14:44 |
| dokma | I get T2080 all over the place | 14:44 |
| gnarface | https://wiki.debian.org/UEFI#Support_for_mixed-mode_systems:_64-bit_system_with_32-bit_UEFI | 14:44 |
| gnarface | this suggests it should be possible | 14:44 |
| gnarface | some other stuff suggests the vendor bios might lock it out anyway | 14:44 |
| gnarface | mixed info coming back from that | 14:44 |
| gnarface | hmm, so here's the thing | 14:45 |
| gnarface | first i looked for a lenovo c200 | 14:46 |
| gnarface | so that's probably wrong, but that was the atom chip | 14:46 |
| gnarface | the "lenovo 3000 c200" lists an actual real core2duo | 14:46 |
| gnarface | and there aren't 32-bit core2duos | 14:46 |
| gnarface | how'd you come up with t2080? | 14:46 |
| gnarface | anyway, check the bios version, make sure it's most recent | 14:48 |
| dokma | just googling lenovo 3000 c200 I'm getting t2080 all over the place | 14:53 |
| dokma | but I'll go cat /proc/cpuinfo to verify | 14:53 |
| gnarface | for what it's worth though, this guy seems to have got 64-bit debian working on the atom one too: https://dwaves.de/2021/04/04/everything-gnu-linux-debian-10-64bit-the-universal-operating-system-on-over-10-year-old-hardware-lenovo-c200-all-in-one-pc-released-2010/ | 14:53 |
| gnarface | so either way, it's supposed to be possible | 14:53 |
| gnarface | and afaik nothing intel made after 2006 was 32-bit | 14:54 |
| gnarface | certainly nothing with more than 1 core, anyway | 14:54 |
| gnarface | bios/uefi/bootloader compatibility issues aside... | 14:54 |
| gnarface | it should work and people have got it working as far back as jessie so the first thing i'd look into is bios version | 14:55 |
| zeno_ | hello, just 1 question, is Daedalus the last release of devuan? | 14:56 |
| gnarface | zeno_: it's current stable, corresponding to current debian stable. you can still try out testing or unstable, they are more recent but don't count as "released" yet | 14:58 |
| gnarface | (same as debian, just different release names) | 14:58 |
| zeno_ | ty, i've made a mistake installing ascii 2 version ^^ | 14:58 |
| gnarface | hah, yes that's quite old. when in doubt use current stable. | 15:01 |
| zeno_ | on a nx compaq made in the far 2008 | 15:02 |
| zeno_ | 1st centrino duo | 15:02 |
| gnarface | supposed to still work in spite of that age, but you never know till you try it | 15:03 |
| zeno_ | exactly, it works very well with the ascii release | 15:04 |
| sensys | guys, can I install devuan with xfce, but without all this libreoffice and other unnecessary(for me) programms? | 15:17 |
| gnarface | sensys: yes | 15:18 |
| sensys | how? | 15:28 |
| avir327 | just install (from netinstall) without DE and then, after reboot, 'apt-get install' the xfce meta-package with the required depandencies. | 15:39 |
| avir327 | "expert install" might be necessary | 15:39 |
| avir327 | not sure, if you need to manually install xorg as well | 15:40 |
| gnarface | sensys: did you install from the live iso? which iso did you use? | 15:44 |
| CueXXIII | sensys: you might want to run apt-get --no-install-recommends install xfce, too; but take note of the recommended packages and decide which you might need | 15:50 |
| gnarface | sensys: if you already installed, it's probably easier to just uninstall the stuff you don't want | 15:54 |
| * avir327 uses debfoster in such cases | 15:55 | |
| gnarface | sensys: if you re-install, don't use the live iso, do select "expert mode" and when you get to Tasksel, just uncheck all the boxes. you're not obligated to use any of the desktop/server preset options provided. you probably will want standard system utilities no matter what, but even that is not mandatory. | 15:55 |
| gnarface | then after your first boot, you can just install whatever you want - "--no-install-recommends" is a good idea if you want less bloat | 15:57 |
| CueXXIII | on current unstable, xfce4 with recommends: 936 MB, --no-install-recommends: 140 MB (on a fairly empty system): https://paste.debian.net/plain/1321345 | 15:59 |
| sensys | is netinstall iso needed for this, or I can use any of iso? | 16:41 |
| gnarface | sensys: the netinstall is probably fastest... | 16:46 |
| dokma | cat /proc/cpuinfo says Celeron M 420 | 19:15 |
| dokma | so... definitely 32bit | 19:16 |
| dokma | looking for an upgrade as daughters cannot watch utube | 19:16 |
| rwp | I am sad that all of the distros are dropping 32-bit support. It feels like an (e)waste situation to force scrapping out all 32-bit hardware just because... | 19:19 |
| mason | rwp: Isn't it mostly installers, and the packages will remain? | 19:23 |
| rwp | mason, I thought it was the entire architectures will be dropped. No? | 19:27 |
| rwp | https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2023/12/msg00003.html | 19:28 |
| mason | rwp: Yeah, that's talking about the d-i and images teams. | 19:31 |
| mason | So if you wanted to do a debootstrap install, that's not on the chopping block. | 19:32 |
| fonky | hi all | 19:34 |
| rwp | Hard to debootstrap without a 64-bit cpu though, since they are dropping 32-bit kernel support. | 19:34 |
| mason | rwp: That's a fair point. | 19:34 |
| rwp | One could run "the last 32-bit kernel" that is available for quite a while. | 19:35 |
| rwp | One could self-compile 32-bit kernels. | 19:35 |
| rwp | Hello fonky. Welcome to the devuan support channel. Support questions are welcome. Social chat is welcome in #devuan-offtopic channel. | 19:37 |
| golinux | Way to go rwp! | 19:45 |
| cousin_luigi | dokma: Might be a good moment to break the piggy bank. | 19:53 |
| dokma | scouring for the cheapest on I can find. trying to not break $15 | 19:54 |
| cousin_luigi | daxot: Ouch. Hard restraint. | 20:02 |
| cousin_luigi | What sort of machine should it be? | 20:02 |
| rwp | With that cost constraint it might be possible to upgrade just the CPU to a 64-bit one. I often see those on ebay for the cheap. | 20:05 |
| cousin_luigi | Probably too slow to have a fluid decoding. | 20:08 |
| cousin_luigi | Maybe a 2nd hand tablet? But then they would lose the linux factor. | 20:08 |
| AlexLikeRock | soup! | 21:08 |
| AlexLikeRock | are you there rrq ? | 21:17 |
| AlexLikeRock | fsmithred, | 21:17 |
| fsmithred | hi | 21:17 |
| AlexLikeRock | hi | 21:17 |
| AlexLikeRock | lest continue, fix "no detect keyboard at X11 " | 21:18 |
| fsmithred | you are 45 seconds into the future | 21:18 |
| AlexLikeRock | at devuan Devuan GNU/Linux 4 \n \l | 21:18 |
| AlexLikeRock | by chroot | 21:18 |
| fsmithred | oh yeah, you were trying to run a desktop in the chroot | 21:19 |
| AlexLikeRock | why im at future ? ? | 21:19 |
| fsmithred | why were you doing it in console | 21:19 |
| AlexLikeRock | hehehehehehehehe | 21:19 |
| fsmithred | I have know idea why or how we are getting this time distortion. | 21:19 |
| AlexLikeRock | soudś cool | 21:19 |
| AlexLikeRock | the MATRIX!!!! ITS REAL !!! | 21:19 |
| fsmithred | hello? | 21:20 |
| AlexLikeRock | hi | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | i say : | 21:21 |
| fsmithred | ok, I was the one in the wrong time slip. | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | soudś cool | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | <AlexLikeRock> the MATRIX!!!! ITS REAL !!! | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | damn ! | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | ok, go to sleep | 21:21 |
| fsmithred | yeah, I saw that. What I really want to know is why you need to do this in console instead of on the desktop. | 21:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | nice drams , dream with SYSTEMD | 21:22 |
| AlexLikeRock | heheheheheheh | 21:22 |
| fsmithred | are you ok with running the chroot desktop inside a window on your main desktop? | 21:23 |
| fsmithred | you can do that with xserver-xephyr | 21:23 |
| fsmithred | brb | 21:23 |
| AlexLikeRock | ok , try... | 21:23 |
| AlexLikeRock | r-xephyr: ordenr not found | 21:24 |
| AlexLikeRock | xserver-xephyr not found | 21:25 |
| AlexLikeRock | not installeit | 21:25 |
| AlexLikeRock | install at main DEVUAN or chroot devuan ??? | 21:25 |
| fsmithred | in chroot | 21:26 |
| fsmithred | do you have a window manager or desktop installed in chroot? | 21:26 |
| AlexLikeRock | ok , yes , mate-desktop | 21:26 |
| fsmithred | ok, I've never done it with mate, but it should work | 21:26 |
| AlexLikeRock | and TWM, (bassssic !) and openbox | 21:27 |
| sensys_ | guys, can you repeat those arguments for dd, please?(I lost them after reboot) | 21:27 |
| fsmithred | you know how to do the bind mounts for sys proc dev and dev/pts? | 21:27 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount -t proc proc /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/proc | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount -t sysfs sys /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/sys | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount -o bind /dev /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/dev | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount -t tmpfs /tmp /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/tmp | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount --bind /dev/pts /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/dev/pts | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount --bind /run /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/run | 21:28 |
| fsmithred | sensys_, <gnarface> if sensys comes back, tell them to just try it without the "bs=1M" part; sometimes large block sizes corrupt writes on cheaper/older devices | 21:28 |
| fsmithred | <gnarface> and i recommend using "conv=fsync" instead of the other combinations, because according to the man page that's the one that actually sounds most appropriate, but the "&& sync" approach should have worked just as well. my guess is the culprit was the block size. | 21:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | at special , rrq say : like that | 21:29 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount -t tmpfs /tmp /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/tmp | 21:29 |
| AlexLikeRock | -t tmpf | 21:29 |
| fsmithred | AlexLikeRock, a simple yes or know would have been enough | 21:29 |
| fsmithred | damn! know/no | 21:29 |
| AlexLikeRock | hahahaha | 21:29 |
| fsmithred | ok, you did a couple I don't do, but that should be fine | 21:29 |
| AlexLikeRock | sorry about | 21:29 |
| fsmithred | now I need to check my notes | 21:30 |
| sensys_ | it's me :D sensys, just registred this account and don't know why I have this _ after | 21:30 |
| AlexLikeRock | say : not found | 21:31 |
| fsmithred | ok, enter the chroot. If you have a regular user in the chroot, you can 'su $user' | 21:31 |
| AlexLikeRock | but its installe it | 21:31 |
| fsmithred | what? | 21:31 |
| fsmithred | enter chroot, you will be root. Install xserver-xephyr | 21:31 |
| AlexLikeRock | how to change terminal to english ? | 21:31 |
| AlexLikeRock | http://paste.debian.net/1321368/ | 21:32 |
| fsmithred | why? | 21:32 |
| AlexLikeRock | i have at spanish | 21:32 |
| AlexLikeRock | # aptitude install xserver-xephyr | 21:32 |
| AlexLikeRock | xserver-xephyr ya está instalado en la versión solicitada | 21:32 |
| AlexLikeRock | im root | 21:33 |
| cousin_luigi | AlexLikeRock: That looks English to me. | 21:33 |
| freepick | Good afternoon everyone, can anyone help me with this? I was installing a package with apt | 21:33 |
| freepick | and I accidentally pressed ctrl + z and the installation was paused, and I don't know how to restart it and I can't use apt for anything else. thank you | 21:33 |
| fsmithred | yeah, I could read it fine. it's already installed. | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | i translate by google , for paste.debian.net | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | xserver-xephyr ya está instalado en la versión solicitada (2:1.20.11-1+deb11u13) | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | No se instalará, actualizará o eliminará ningún paquete. | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | 0 paquetes actualizados, 0 nuevos instalados, 0 para eliminar y 0 sin actualizar. | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | Necesito descargar 0 B de ficheros. Después de desempaquetar se usarán 0 B. | 21:33 |
| AlexLikeRock | 21:33 | |
| AlexLikeRock | hi freepick | 21:34 |
| fsmithred | freepick, the command is fg | 21:34 |
| AlexLikeRock | freepick, press the up arrow key , | 21:34 |
| fsmithred | to bring it to the foreground | 21:34 |
| AlexLikeRock | and appear the las command | 21:35 |
| AlexLikeRock | what error say ? | 21:35 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:35 |
| AlexLikeRock | fsmithred, not run xserver-xephyr | 21:35 |
| AlexLikeRock | lets google-it ! ? search = how-to-change-language-only-for-terminal | 21:36 |
| fsmithred | commands are all in the same language | 21:38 |
| fsmithred | do you have an unprivileged user in the chroot system? | 21:38 |
| freepick | thanks fsmithred! | 21:38 |
| fsmithred | if so, 'su <username>' | 21:38 |
| AlexLikeRock | no, im root all ready | 21:39 |
| AlexLikeRock | root@DELL:~# | 21:39 |
| fsmithred | ok, answer this question: Do you have an unprivileged user in the chroot system? Did you create one? Or does only the root account exist? | 21:40 |
| AlexLikeRock | must be normal user or root ; xserver-xephyr ?? | 21:40 |
| AlexLikeRock | yes , | 21:40 |
| fsmithred | if you're going to run X, you should be regular user, not root. | 21:40 |
| fsmithred | su <username> | 21:40 |
| fsmithred | to become that user | 21:40 |
| AlexLikeRock | done | 21:40 |
| fsmithred | but also need to know how to start mate | 21:40 |
| AlexLikeRock | user@DELL:~$ xserver-xephyr | 21:41 |
| AlexLikeRock | bash: xserver-xephyr: orden no encontrada | 21:41 |
| fsmithred | when doing it with xfce, you use the startxfce4 command | 21:41 |
| AlexLikeRock | ¬_¬ | 21:41 |
| fsmithred | please wait before running commands | 21:41 |
| fsmithred | Xephyr :1 -screen 1024x768 -resizeable & sleep 2 ; DISPLAY=:1 startxfce4 | 21:42 |
| fsmithred | replace startxfce4 with whatever starts mate | 21:42 |
| AlexLikeRock | i make a modification | 21:42 |
| AlexLikeRock | startx xserver-xephyr openbox | 21:42 |
| AlexLikeRock | hostname: No address associated with hostname | 21:42 |
| AlexLikeRock | xauth: (stdin):1: bad display name "DELL:0" in "add" command | 21:42 |
| AlexLikeRock | coool ! DISPLAY=:1 | 21:42 |
| fsmithred | what add command? | 21:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | AT START "STARTX" | 21:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | iobo@DELL:~$ Xephyr :1 -screen 1024x768 -resizeable & sleep 2 ; DISPLAY=:1 openbox | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | [2] 18904 | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | Xephyr cannot open host display. Is DISPLAY set? | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | [2]- Salida 1 Xephyr :1 -screen 1024x768 -resizeable | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | Openbox-Message: No se pudo abrir la pantalla desde la variable de entorno DISPLAY | 21:44 |
| fsmithred | is there something like a /usr/bin/mate-session command? | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | thats its binari file | 21:44 |
| fsmithred | are you doing this in a terminal on your desktop or in console? | 21:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | i got a little fail | 21:45 |
| AlexLikeRock | " Xephyr cannot open host display. Is DISPLAY set?" | 21:45 |
| fsmithred | where are you? | 21:46 |
| fsmithred | are you doing this in a terminal on your desktop or in console? | 21:46 |
| fsmithred | are you doing this in a terminal on your desktop or in console? | 21:46 |
| AlexLikeRock | at chroot at teminla | 21:46 |
| fsmithred | a terminal window on a graphical desktop? | 21:46 |
| AlexLikeRock | yes | 21:46 |
| fsmithred | ok | 21:46 |
| fsmithred | Xephyr :1 -screen 1024x768 -resizeable & sleep 2 ; DISPLAY=:1 openbox-session | 21:49 |
| AlexLikeRock | i think io have problems with client : X11 socket | 21:49 |
| AlexLikeRock | same error | 21:50 |
| AlexLikeRock | Xephyr cannot open host display. Is DISPLAY set? | 21:50 |
| fsmithred | echo $DISPLAY | 21:50 |
| AlexLikeRock | EMPY | 21:50 |
| AlexLikeRock | like say SILENT HILL : | 21:51 |
| AlexLikeRock | "nothing happen" | 21:51 |
| AlexLikeRock | OR | 21:51 |
| AlexLikeRock | "nothing special" | 21:51 |
| AlexLikeRock | let me startx | 21:51 |
| AlexLikeRock | i willo lost control of keyboard and reboot | 21:52 |
| sensys_ | without "bs=1M" I retrieving "dd: writing to '/dev/sdb': Input/output error | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | iobo@DELL:~$ startx | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | hostname: No address associated with hostname | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | xauth: (stdin):1: bad display name "DELL:0" in "add" command | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | X connection to :0 broken (explicit kill or server shutdown). | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | xauth: (argv):1: bad display name "DELL:0" in "remove" command | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | No se pudo conseguir un descriptor de fichero que refiera a la consola. | 21:52 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:52 |
| fsmithred | I'm confused. Where are you running startx? | 21:53 |
| AlexLikeRock | at mate terminal | 21:53 |
| AlexLikeRock | by chroot | 21:53 |
| AlexLikeRock | at old devuan | 21:53 |
| AlexLikeRock | cat /etc/issue | 21:54 |
| AlexLikeRock | Devuan GNU/Linux 4 \n | 21:54 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:57 |
| AlexLikeRock | the actual DESKTOP (im talking from here) : cat /etc/issue | 21:58 |
| AlexLikeRock | Devuan GNU/Linux daedalus \n \l | 21:58 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 21:58 |
| fsmithred | and you ran that last command in the chroot? | 21:58 |
| AlexLikeRock | yes | 21:58 |
| fsmithred | but DISPLAY is not set? That's weird. You're not doing this over ssh, are you? | 21:59 |
| fsmithred | sensys_, maybe try a different block size. Maybe bs=65536 | 22:00 |
| AlexLikeRock | but you now, i came from mixed distros ; migrate from x32 to x64 | 22:00 |
| AlexLikeRock | and i came from jessie to daedalus , and foud problems. and back to chimaera | 22:01 |
| AlexLikeRock | its no by ssh | 22:01 |
| AlexLikeRock | i al ready touching the keyboard | 22:01 |
| AlexLikeRock | by my own hands :-> | 22:02 |
| sensys_ | fsmithred, okay, now without errors, I'll try to boot | 22:02 |
| fsmithred | AlexLikeRock, I don't know what to try next. | 22:03 |
| AlexLikeRock | sensys_, what are you try to burn ? | 22:03 |
| AlexLikeRock | fsmithred, lets try startx | 22:03 |
| AlexLikeRock | startx as root : | 22:04 |
| AlexLikeRock | (EE) Cannot establish any listening sockets - Make sure an X server isn't already running(EE) | 22:04 |
| AlexLikeRock | whera are the sopcket ? | 22:07 |
| AlexLikeRock | /run/... ? | 22:07 |
| fsmithred | is there an xserver already running? | 22:08 |
| AlexLikeRock | welll | 22:20 |
| AlexLikeRock | remenber | 22:20 |
| AlexLikeRock | the line to mount : | 22:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | mount --bind /run /media/alex/deVuan-ninos1/run | 22:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | its chroot "/RUN" | 22:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | i have runing at HOST devuan | 22:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | thats why found the socket | 22:22 |
| fsmithred | I was able to get the same error as you | 22:23 |
| fsmithred | by trying to run Xephyr as root instead of user | 22:23 |
| AlexLikeRock | thats why found the socket X11 socket ? | 22:24 |
| AlexLikeRock | to delete ? | 22:24 |
| AlexLikeRock | or create ? | 22:24 |
| fsmithred | I don't know | 22:25 |
| AlexLikeRock | mmmm ¬_¬U | 22:26 |
| AlexLikeRock | you know everything, fsmithred . you can't tell me that | 22:26 |
| fsmithred | I don't know everything and I can't get it to work here now. | 22:28 |
| AlexLikeRock | hehehehe | 22:28 |
| fsmithred | It worked about a month ago. It might be that I need to upgrade the chroot system - it's excalibur and there are over 300 updates waiting. | 22:29 |
| fsmithred | I can't tell you why there's no DISPLAY set on your desktop. I think that might be an important clue. | 22:30 |
| AlexLikeRock | i cant't upgrade, because , are UNSTABLE to install with APT | 22:30 |
| AlexLikeRock | yesh | 22:30 |
| fsmithred | are you saying that you can't upgrade to excalibur? Or something else. I don't understand. | 22:31 |
| AlexLikeRock | yes, | 22:31 |
| AlexLikeRock | the last time , i stock to install kernel | 22:32 |
| fsmithred | ok, I was not suggesting that you should upgrade to excalibur. I was saying that my excalibur is probably broken. | 22:32 |
| fsmithred | because it's excalibur. | 22:32 |
| fsmithred | You should run testing or unstable if you want a broken system. | 22:32 |
| fsmithred | but if you want to get anything done, use stable. | 22:32 |
| AlexLikeRock | fsmithred, I FOUND A pretty good script : https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/slackware-64-14-2-chroot-slackware-32-14-2-xfce4-session-dunnos-4175704950/ | 22:41 |
| * AlexLikeRock are drunk ! | 23:02 | |
| AlexLikeRock | save awesome link of slack ! | 23:02 |
| rrq | AlexLikeRock: I think I gave bad advice to make /tmp its own filesystem, when you want to run xephyr | 23:08 |
| rrq | Xorg has its sockets in /tmp | 23:09 |
| rrq | thus: don't make a tmpfs for /tmp, but rather bind-mount the main /tmo | 23:13 |
| rrq | .. the main /tmp | 23:13 |
| fsmithred | when I've used xephyr in the past, I only needed to mount sys proc dev and dev/pts | 23:14 |
| AlexLikeRock | by by habit | 23:14 |
| AlexLikeRock | hi rrq | 23:14 |
| AlexLikeRock | is it necessary ? | 23:15 |
| AlexLikeRock | 23:15 | |
| AlexLikeRock | tmp and run ? | 23:16 |
| rrq | fsmithred: hmm.. how does it find the man Xorg, then? | 23:16 |
| fsmithred | I don't know, and right now it's not working. I'm upgrading my excalibur chroot now. | 23:19 |
| rrq | (I have only used separate chroot-Xorg in separate VT; never tried xephyr) | 23:19 |
| fsmithred | and also not do it over nfs mount this time. Not sure if that was a problem. | 23:19 |
| freepick | Hello again, I'm looking for how to add a daemon at startup, but I only find methods with systemd. | 23:20 |
| freepick | I need to add picom so that it starts on login | 23:20 |
| rrq | freepick: desktop environments usually have "autostart" wher one can add stuff | 23:21 |
| AlexLikeRock | rrq, ok, show how to do ? | 23:21 |
| freepick | rrq i have lxde i dont find haha | 23:22 |
| freepick | i find it, thanks!! | 23:23 |
| AlexLikeRock | you welcome | 23:23 |
| rrq | AlexLikeRock: the xephyr way sounded easier ... | 23:25 |
| AlexLikeRock | lst do it like last time we did ! | 23:26 |
| AlexLikeRock | and work run as guues | 23:26 |
| rrq | was a problem getting the input device connection to work, wasn't it | 23:27 |
| AlexLikeRock | shure | 23:29 |
| fsmithred | too bad freepick left. lxde uses openbox and you can add commands to ~/.config/openbox/autostart | 23:29 |
| fsmithred | too bad freepick left. lxde uses openbox and you can add commands to ~/.config/openbox/autostart | 23:30 |
| AlexLikeRock | what next? | 23:30 |
| rrq | AlexLikeRock: for a chroot I think the easiest is then to use seatd in the chroot; the main may use elogind | 23:30 |
| * fsmithred loves his up arrow | 23:30 | |
| freepick | fsmithred here I am, I had just found it. | 23:31 |
| freepick | I have another question, I don't use ssh. Why do I see ssh agents running in the task manager? | 23:31 |
| rrq | then, in the terminal window of the main Xorg in VT7, you run "openvt -c 8 /bin/bash" .. to start a bash in VT8 | 23:33 |
| rrq | you do that in the chroot! | 23:33 |
| rrq | then the bash of VT8 runs within the chroot as well | 23:33 |
| rrq | then, you shift to VT8 with Ctrl-Alt-F8 | 23:34 |
| rrq | you can shift back with Ctrl-Alt-F7 | 23:34 |
| rrq | all good so far? you can shift between the main Xorg in VT7 and the bash console in VT8 ? | 23:37 |
| rrq | the bash console is within the chroot | 23:38 |
| rrq | AlexLikeRock: all good so far? | 23:38 |
| AlexLikeRock | i add openvt -c 8 /bin/bash to | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | Xephyr :1 -screen 1024x768 -resizeable & sleep 2 ; DISPLAY=:1 openbox-session openvt -c 8 /bin/bash | 23:43 |
| rrq | no | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | and work at half | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | open a black window | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | See the openbox-session(1) manpage for help. | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | iobo@DELL:~$ The XKEYBOARD keymap compiler (xkbcomp) reports: | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86CameraAccessEnable | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86CameraAccessDisable | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86CameraAccessToggle | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86NextElement | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86PreviousElement | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86AutopilotEngageToggle | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86MarkWaypoint | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86Sos | 23:43 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86NavChart | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86FishingChart | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86SingleRangeRadar | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86DualRangeRadar | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86RadarOverlay | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86TraditionalSonar | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86ClearvuSonar | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86SidevuSonar | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | > Internal error: Could not resolve keysym XF86NavInfo | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | Errors from xkbcomp are not fatal to the X server | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | . | 23:44 |
| AlexLikeRock | anpother clue | 23:44 |
| rrq | if you want to run xephyr you do nothing of what I told you | 23:44 |
| rrq | but rather try to follow fsmithred's instructions | 23:45 |
| AlexLikeRock | ¬_¬ | 23:45 |
| fsmithred | freepick, ssh-agent is used for ssh client to connect to a remote server. | 23:45 |
| fsmithred | it's probably just part of the desktop bloat. | 23:46 |
| * rrq doing breakfast | 23:47 | |
| * AlexLikeRock go to pisss | 23:50 | |
| Xenguy | AlexLikeRock, we don't need that much information, thanks in advance | 23:50 |
| fsmithred | ok, I finally got it to work. I had to switch to using :2 instead of :1 for the Xephyr display | 23:54 |
| fsmithred | and yeah, TMI | 23:54 |
| fsmithred | btw some of these tasks might work better sans ethanol. | 23:55 |
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